Difference between revisions of "User talk:Snowball II"

Revision as of 19:45, February 25, 2024

Hello, and welcome to Wikisimpsons! Thank you for taking an interest in our wiki. If you have any troubles, feel free to ask questions on any experienced editors' talk page. Here are a few pages to help out new editors such as most likely yourself: Wikisimpsons' Policies Help pages, your first stop if you need any help Editing help, in case you have questions on how to properly edit articles Please sign your name on talk pages by using four tildes (~~~~). This will automatically produce your name and the date. Signing your comments is important, as it lets other editors know who has posted which comments. Again, welcome! Solar Dragon (Talk • Contribs.) 18:08, December 8, 2013 (EST)

Conor

The tweet you linked to said that Chris Edgerly was Conor, not Daniel Radcliffe. Al Jean also confirmed this to me in a DM. Also, the book in the episode calls him "Conor", with only one n. Thanks, The Solar Dragon 16:31, April 9, 2018 (EDT)

Again, his name is Conor, not Connor, as you can see here. The Solar Dragon 16:39, April 9, 2018 (EDT)

Mrs. Glick

Hi, why exactly did you change "Alice Glick" to "Mrs. Glick" in multiple places? Her full name is Alice Glick, her page name is Alice Glick. She should be referred to as such. The Solar Dragon 07:41, September 15, 2019 (EDT)

Even at the top of the article is she is generally just referred to as Mrs. Glick and most folks any known her such. Snowball II (talk) 17:28, September 16, 2019 (EDT)

It's still her name so pages should be left like that. And the page title is "Alice Glick". Please do not make any more of these changes. The Solar Dragon 06:20, September 17, 2019 (EDT)

The body of the article is not the same thing as links from other pages i.e. we use "Marge" or "Bart" in the body in the article rather just using full title of the article "Marge Simpson" or "Bart Simpson" at every instance. Snowball II (talk) 17:35, September 17, 2019 (EDT)

Block

"Thank you, come again!" ―Apu Nahasapeemapetilon You have been blocked for a period of 1 week due to disruptive editing. If you would like to be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding your reasons below, and your appeal will be reviewed by the blocking admin. The Solar Dragon 18:07, September 17, 2019 (EDT)

You were warned. Twice. Since you decided to go ahead and change it again, I have blocked you for a week. The Solar Dragon 18:07, September 17, 2019 (EDT)

I just figured stuff like Dr. Hibbert rather than Julius Hibbert or Superintendent Chalmers rather than Gary Chalmers was just a good faith style choice rather than something one gets blocked over. Thinking about it more, it can lead too much confusing and best to stick with the title of the page. It's fine, I wish you remove the block and I won't use "Mrs. Glick" any more in the article. I didn't think it would matter that much and I thought you were only referring to the changes to Reference section of episode articles, but I thought editing the body of the article was fine. Snowball II (talk) 18:50, September 17, 2019 (EDT)

Character statuses

Appearances gallery artwork

Hello, please stick with the character's default artwork in appearances galleries. Often, they are only wearing these costumes for a short period in an episode, and it's not representative of the character fully. Plus, it makes trying to find their appearances a lot harder. Thank you, The Solar Dragon 19:35, January 2, 2024 (EST)

I wouldn't totally agree since these appearance pages are unique to each episode and noticed locations sections for episode aren't uniform since they looked different in different episode and a top of costumes are unique to a specific episode which an user would be able to see if he/she check "used on" section of the file. If you 100% with or without me making a case, so be it. The main characters so seeing Lisa in a gymnast's outfit where gymnastics are a major plot element isn't the same as off a background one-off character. Snowball II (talk) 21:10, January 2, 2024 (EST)

Yes, I am 100% on this. A good thing about having the images be uniform across the Appearances galleries is that it allows you to find the appearances a character has made by looking at their image links. Splitting that up across multiple images will mean that some get missed. Plus, keeping uniform across the wiki is always a good thing. Characters will only get different images in Appearances galleries if their appearances are radically different throughout the episode. i.e. Episodes set nearly fully in the future, or completely different artstyles. The Solar Dragon 07:08, January 3, 2024 (EST)

I do appreciate you taking the time and efffort for a through and thought-out response. Again I don't totally agree with everyone of your points and do kind of wish you were flexible and negotiable, but I won't push it if you're 100% solid on it. Snowball II (talk) 15:02, January 3, 2024 (EST)

Stealing First Base characters

Hi, I think I've moved all the characters you marked to be moved. Could you go about fixing up their pages and changing them over to the correct characters please? I'd do so myself but I'm kind of busy. Thanks, The Solar Dragon 14:14, January 18, 2024 (EST)

Senator Payne and moving of articles

Hello, please do not move articles to different names like that, especially when the name you are moving the article to goes against the official material for the show. In future, please bring up all move requests on the article's talk page. I have access to multiple sources for character names so I can check to make sure they are official to the show. Thank you, The Solar Dragon 06:57, February 9, 2024 (EST)

Appearances

Hi, when you add appearances to an individual article, can you also add them to the episode's appearance page too? I noticed you added a lot of appearances to the Volvo article, but didn't add them to the episodes. It helps to make sure the appearances are accurate if they're listed in both places. Thank you, The Solar Dragon 07:53, February 25, 2024 (EST)

Hiya, thank you for adding Cletus' pickup to the episode pages. There were two things that gave me a slight pause. One was just decided to take a break and figured I'd get to it in a bit. The other was the image is specifically Tab Spangler's Volvo which I debated a bit would be the one to put for any and all Volvo vehicles.[1][2][3][4][5][6][7]

The article already mentioned other examples of Volvos, but the Image was only on the episode it appeared in File:Tab Spangler's Volvo.png and other examples already mentioned weren't mentioned on the actual episode My Sister, My Sitter/Appearances

Plus had the example of the image used on the Mercedes-Benz page in the back of my mind since it's only used in the specific episode is comes from. File:Mercedes-Benz.png Snowball II (talk) 11:32, February 25, 2024 (EST)

It'll be fine to use Tab Spangler's Volvo as it's just an example of one Volvo. So, feel free to use it on other Appearances articles for the Volvo image. Same should go for Mercedes Benz. The Solar Dragon 12:52, February 25, 2024 (EST)

Actually, looking at the notability policy, I'm not sure that the Volvo or Mercedes-Benz pages should exist. They're brands of vehicles, rather than a specific vehicle. And they're not exactly named, and a majority aren't recurring enough for an article. The Solar Dragon 14:27, February 25, 2024 (EST)

Well if you're unsure, I have some ideas to bounce off of if you'd like? Snowball II (talk) 15:04, February 25, 2024 (EST)

Feel free to share those then. Because at the moment, I'm leaning towards deleting the Volvo and Mercedes-Benz articles. The Solar Dragon 16:40, February 25, 2024 (EST)

You're going to do with you think it best, but also no major rush either to come back to it. I'd look over http://www.imcdb.org/movie_96697-The-Simpsons.html might for yourself since people have an interest in it.

Just random thoughts since I'm kind of like parts of it, but it's not without issues either.

Unsure if Cecil Terwilliger's car needs it's own article, but still interesting to know it's a Volvo since they made the effort to make it one. What also confuses it a bit it is a bit of the floating continuity things since Principal Skinner has been pretty consistently shown driving a Volvo, but not always (http://frinkiac.com/caption/S17E11/113989 http://frinkiac.com/caption/S05E09/79345) They have mentioned the car companies, but for sure not often, but logo are very distinctive (particularly on the grills). #1, #2, #3, #4, #5 Add in the research of the people are doing online to determine the make and model of the vehicles. I'd point out that I didn't list off every background incident. I tried to stay to major or even minor characters are shown driving them or the Volvo or the Mercedes-Benz played some part in the plot. Sorry this is just some of my first thoughts haven't thought it through if it's fine as is, can be improved or just removed. Snowball II (talk) 17:26, February 25, 2024 (EST)

I feel that for most cars, it'll be a case of the car being based on a real vehicle, but with some differences and without any mention of the brand usually, because of licensing and advertising etc. As such, they'd probably mostly be parodies of real vehicle brands. Similar to how Mapple is a parody of Apple. However, Apple has also been mentioned within the show. However, we can't know for sure unless it's mentioned in the show. Therefore, the cars would likely be based on Volvo models, but unless stated, they could also be some sort of parody of the model. Unless it's stated what it is in the show, we can't know for sure. It's a complex grey area. I'd say it'll be fine to mention on the references page "X's car is based on a Volvo model" but I don't feel like Volvo should have its own article, because of the reasons I mentioned. The Solar Dragon 17:49, February 25, 2024 (EST)

What's more, I can't seem to find a solid mention of "Volvo" for Tab Spangler's Volvo. Which would also mean that's against the notability policy too. The Solar Dragon 17:51, February 25, 2024 (EST)

I'm not an expert, but I remember reading the reason TV shows don't use branded products within a scene is because of advertising (the show wants the companies to pay for their product to appear on the show). The show don't have the license a brand name or logo, they do it all the time. They named Volvo and Mercedes-Benz and also use their logos.

Dialogue is nice, but it's not the sole requirement. It's shown and there are loads of example where something or someone isn't named aloud, but still has an article based on the visuals. Snowball II (talk) 17:59, February 25, 2024 (EST)

I disagree. The fact is, there are various different parodies of real things within the show. Including a lot of brands. For example, with cars, we have Tissan, a parody of Nissan. Would that make all cars based on Nissan Tissan cars? We can't really say. So, I feel an article for Volvo is unnecessary, we can just list what cars are based on in the References page, and if a vehicle does have an article (i.e. Pink Sedan) we can mention what the vehicle is based on in Behind the Laughter. But having a whole article for a car brand, that the cars listed might not even be made by in-universe, feels wrong to me. The Solar Dragon 18:07, February 25, 2024 (EST)

An example seems like a bit of leap that it now makes it an undisputable universal fact for everything unless said aloud within the episode. We know Volvo exists in the Simpsonsverse so unsure why it would exist in one episode and cease to exist in another episode because it's not in dialogue. Of course the shows has parody products, but I can point to examples of real world products i.e. Dumpster is a real brand which the call out themselves. We come back to this disagreement a lot where if something is 100% implicit, you err towards pretending we knew only what the show 100% tells us (sorry as pretending isn't the right word, but I guess just because tree trunks are purple we don't say it's a tree only it they say). The joke about clouds like the one looking like a crashing school bus or Jedediah Springfield status without a head isn't how clouds work, but doesn't mean the term "cloud" can never be used unless said aloud. Buzz Cola doesn't mean Coca-Cola doesn't exist and they've mentioned Apple even with Mapple and they've mentioned Arnold Schwarzenegger even with Rainier Wolfencastle. Also just because Rainier Wolfencastle exists, doesn't mean every celebrity shown is a similar parody unless named aloud and the wiki has plenty of them. Anyhow acting like unless they say it's a Volvo, it has to be parody is a choice the same as deciding it's just a Volvo. It's a character is drinking a brown soda pop, I can get assuming it's might be a Coke or a Pepsi or Buzz Cola, but I just don't see the big harm is the wiki having Tab Spangler's car being a Volvo was it's clearly a Volvo and no parody of Volvo has ever been established. Snowball II (talk) 18:49, February 25, 2024 (EST)

Tab Spangler's Volvo is something I feel can be mentioned on the references page, that it seems to be based on a Volvo. But it is against the notability policy as it currently is, because it's not really named (a make is not a name). The same will also extend to the Volvo article and Mercedes-Benz article. They can be mentioned on References pages, but I don't think they need their own articles. The Solar Dragon 18:56, February 25, 2024 (EST)

But as tend to happen on Wikis somebody else clearly did believe it was worth an article and I toke the time to add to it. I did the Mercedes-Benz edits awhile ago and again unsure why it's now a violation of policy. Snowball II (talk) 19:08, February 25, 2024 (EST)

For the episode if you'd prefer the make of the car this or that drives goes on the references page rather than appearance page, that makes sense to me. Snowball II (talk) 19:27, February 25, 2024 (EST)

It's not a case of it "now" being in violation of the policy, it's more a case of it slipped through the net and got missed. Hell, I've sometimes edited articles, or even created articles, that I look back on and go "Actually, that isn't notable enough for an article, as per the notability policy". Also, many articles were created well before the most recent notability guidelines were made. And for the fact you took time to add to pages, I'm sorry about that. And I know it can suck to see work you've done get removed or deleted for reasons. But, wikis are also collaborative efforts and sometimes, stuff gets removed or changed. And yeah, they're good to be mentioned under the References page, most likely under Cultural references. The Solar Dragon 19:28, February 25, 2024 (EST)

I get typos and others stuff slipping through the cracks or even reconsidering an article or old edit, but this can't have been that egregious of a violation since made these edits and stood for some time and even earlier today you were fine with them. If it's not a clear-cut violation, I don't see what would be the issue against discussing it towards an understanding. I get you disagree, but that's seems like it's the one and only take to be used. Snowball II (talk) 19:40, February 25, 2024 (EST)

Seems more like a "Trivia" than a "Cultural Reference"? Or maybe "Continuity" i.e. reappearance of Principal Skinner driving a Volvo. Snowball II (talk) 19:43, February 25, 2024 (EST)

I don't check every single edit or article and often I will miss them. As for earlier today, I wasn't even thinking about the notability policy. It was only later when I was thinking back on it, I realized it was against the notability policy. I'm not always thinking about the policies, and often I will have to check them myself to check if something goes against policy or not. As for what section it goes to, brand parodies generally go under Cultural references as brands are part of culture. If a vehicle makes a reappearance, that can go under Continuity. The Solar Dragon 19:45, February 25, 2024 (EST)